1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

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LorenAlbert
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1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by LorenAlbert » Fri Aug 21, 2020 7:00 pm

Would someone please explain/conjecture about what caused the rectangles at the base of the denticular clefts that are located below the date. Are these of the die, the collar, or maybe the optics?

1921-P VAM-32A I3R5 AW030720 Click on the photograph to view at high resolution.
Image

RogerB
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by RogerB » Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:26 am

Looks as if the denticles were cut too deeply. Each raised tooth is really a cut into the die. If the cut is too deep it could interfere with rim formation next to the collar. Suggests haste in doing the work....common enough in 1921 Morgans.

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LorenAlbert
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by LorenAlbert » Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:18 am

RogerB wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:26 am
Looks as if the denticles were cut too deeply. Each raised tooth is really a cut into the die. If the cut is too deep it could interfere with rim formation next to the collar. Suggests haste in doing the work....common enough in 1921 Morgans.
Thank you. I have always been a bit fuzzy about the denticles, rim, and collar. It seems that I need to get back to the books. The "denticles were cut too deeply." Does this apply to the working die or a hub? Are the denticles, rim, and collar covered in "Mine to Mint?"

RogerB
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by RogerB » Sun Aug 23, 2020 12:45 pm

This would likely be in the working die when someone did repair or touch-up work. Denticles are part of the design and thus part of the hub.

The subjects are discussed in From Mine to Mint, but I don't think this specific detail is mentioned. (I will put that on the list for FMTM-2.)

May I use your photo and credit line in FMTM-2 ?

shortnock
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by shortnock » Sun Aug 23, 2020 5:44 pm

Wow! Superfine photo. Good information, too.
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DHalladay
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by DHalladay » Sun Aug 23, 2020 6:27 pm

What I like most about my 32A is the mini rim cuds under the date:

32911300 date cuds cropped.jpg
32911300 date cuds cropped.jpg (178.41 KiB) Viewed 757 times
When in doubt... don't.

Kissov
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by Kissov » Sun Aug 23, 2020 6:51 pm

DHalladay wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 6:27 pm
What I like most about my 32A is the mini rim cuds under the date:
Cudlets!

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LorenAlbert
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by LorenAlbert » Sun Aug 23, 2020 8:19 pm

RogerB wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 12:45 pm
May I use your photo and credit line in FMTM-2 ?
Please contact Andy (andywoj00). Andy is the photographer. More images are available here.

RogerRock
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by RogerRock » Sun Aug 23, 2020 8:33 pm

Excellent details on photo ! Flow lines below denticles from 3:00 to 9:00 indicate movement of obverse die when strike was initiated. AKA - STRIKE DOUBLING
Stage 3 TERMINAL DIE STATE SILVER DOLLAR EXPLORER

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andywoj00
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by andywoj00 » Sun Aug 23, 2020 9:13 pm

RogerB wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 12:45 pm
This would likely be in the working die when someone did repair or touch-up work. Denticles are part of the design and thus part of the hub.

The subjects are discussed in From Mine to Mint, but I don't think this specific detail is mentioned. (I will put that on the list for FMTM-2.)

May I use your photo and credit line in FMTM-2 ?
My Photo. Use whatever you need to get the info out....Andy (andywoj00)

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CascadeChris
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by CascadeChris » Sun Aug 23, 2020 9:23 pm

This is a pretty common feature fwiw.. When I was green I sent a new die pair in to the big guy and mentioned this feature in my write up as also having a possible collar clash. In his return letter he called it, and im paraphrasing here, "a striking error, which is not listable."
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mikev50
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by mikev50 » Sun Aug 23, 2020 10:00 pm

nice coin-interesting--what set up do you use to get these great photos--thank you

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andywoj00
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Re: 1921-P VAM-32A Rectangles at Base of Denticular Clefts?

Post by andywoj00 » Sun Aug 23, 2020 11:33 pm

mikev50 wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 10:00 pm
nice coin-interesting--what set up do you use to get these great photos--thank you
Thanks to all for the compliments on the pic. LOTS of great pics by other members on this board at the Vamworld wiki.

I have a Canon DSLR with a 100mm macro lens set up on a modified Bausch and Lomb stereo microscope stand.

This particular coin was fairly easy to shoot as the lighting cooperated with the coin topography. Alot of times it's a real fight to shoot LFCPs and get the details to show in support of the related VAM characteristics.

I do regionals as well that can be seen at the Silverdye link above. Lots of cool coins and pics there from other SD members that frequent this board...check it out....Andy

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