1880 VAM Puzzle

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ChrisPaulis
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1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by ChrisPaulis » Thu Aug 10, 2023 8:10 pm

Today's conundrum: I have an 1880 Morgan that appears to be the III3 obverse of VAM-28; however, neither of the die markers is present. In addition, whether they are irrelevant or not, there are several distinctive features that I cannon locate in any of the VAM listings -- a large die chip in the middle of the eagle's right wing, a dot in the left wing, and a die chip in the G on the reverse. In addition, there is doubling in the outer edges of the wreath.
Additional photos follow in the comments.

Any guidance would be appreciated.
Attachments
1880 VAM-unk AU-06.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-06.jpg (300.37 KiB) Viewed 683 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-04.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-04.jpg (321.03 KiB) Viewed 683 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-03.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-03.jpg (311.84 KiB) Viewed 683 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-02.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-02.jpg (333.1 KiB) Viewed 683 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-01.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-01.jpg (240.61 KiB) Viewed 683 times
Chris Paulis, M.Photog.,M.Artist,Cr., CPP, EA-ASP

ChrisPaulis
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Re: 1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by ChrisPaulis » Thu Aug 10, 2023 8:10 pm

Additional images
Attachments
1880 VAM-unk AU-11.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-11.jpg (306.47 KiB) Viewed 682 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-10.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-10.jpg (308.9 KiB) Viewed 682 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-09.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-09.jpg (323.44 KiB) Viewed 682 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-08.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-08.jpg (263.27 KiB) Viewed 682 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-07.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-07.jpg (271.64 KiB) Viewed 682 times
Chris Paulis, M.Photog.,M.Artist,Cr., CPP, EA-ASP

MarkyB
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Re: 1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by MarkyB » Thu Aug 10, 2023 9:30 pm

I think you have either a 1-80 or --80. I came away with either a 67 or an 80. GL

ChrisPaulis
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Re: 1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by ChrisPaulis » Thu Aug 10, 2023 9:44 pm

The 1 is definitely doubled on the bottom.
Chris Paulis, M.Photog.,M.Artist,Cr., CPP, EA-ASP

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Albannach
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Re: 1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by Albannach » Thu Aug 10, 2023 10:18 pm

I am little help on attribution for this date. The state of the coin is problematic. That being said:

The chip in the G God is a typical occurrence with this series. It's a weak spot and tends to happen while coining. I say this because I can line up the 1882 V5 series and tell you it occurred late mid to early late state of the die...Wether it's eds or lds stage I can't really say on yours (you'll need a die study guru for 80-P). By the pics, the wing and breast feathers indicate early or mid (load LFCP or zoom out some pls) Need to see polishing on the Eagle.

The dots in the wing and the thread like impression are what I like to call pepper in fly shit. Not necessarily listable features (this of course is not for me to say)and may or may not have been present in all stages. They are helpful in die identification, worthy of a listing? again, not for me to say.

Now, the doubling you see on the rev...
I'm betting it is not a doubled die, but MDD. Your obv doubling appears to be dbl die (the star looks flat and shelf like). The cap, ummm hmmm how to say...

In 82, I've seen it listed and I have seen it ignored. If this was an 82, I would dismiss it as ejection doubling as it's moving in the same direction, but only on a couple devices (again, just me).

I love the reverse stuff, if I were studying this date, I would ask to hold and photograph it.

Hope that was somewhat helpful.

Brickie
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Re: 1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by Brickie » Thu Aug 10, 2023 10:55 pm

Hi Chris, take a peek at the VAM-25 series. The die chip on the right wing should be a match.

rhodes6467
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Re: 1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by rhodes6467 » Thu Aug 10, 2023 11:58 pm

Nice, Brickie! I was about to agree with Albannach on about everything but you have found a match.

ChrisPaulis
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Re: 1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by ChrisPaulis » Fri Aug 11, 2023 12:12 am

@Brickie you are right! Because the coin has wear, the chip between the lip and chin is barely visible, so I didn’t notice it. I have to check later to see if it may be 25A; I may have seen the U clash….
Chris Paulis, M.Photog.,M.Artist,Cr., CPP, EA-ASP

ChrisPaulis
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Re: 1880 VAM Puzzle

Post by ChrisPaulis » Fri Aug 11, 2023 12:18 am

VAM-25A. Very faint, but the U is there! Thanks, everyone!
Attachments
1880 VAM-unk AU-13.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-13.jpg (242.02 KiB) Viewed 642 times
1880 VAM-unk AU-12.jpg
1880 VAM-unk AU-12.jpg (281.65 KiB) Viewed 642 times
Chris Paulis, M.Photog.,M.Artist,Cr., CPP, EA-ASP

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