1923-P_Lost in the 'Polished Triangle 19'

[Geseas]

Hello everyone.

Thanks for this great site of keen observation!

I am looking for photographs of any 1923-P Peace Dollar with a polished area between the '1' and the '9' of the DATE.
Hopefully a photo would include the Bust Point and part of the Neck Line with any die cracks/brakes cutting through.

Here is what I have found so far:
Photo 1 second specimen

1923 vam1ck.jpg (74.33 KiB) Viewed 1753 times

Photo 2.

gcs_1923-p new coin.jpg (224.2 KiB) Viewed 1753 times

Photo 3.

DKC1923_VAM_1BY.jpg (55.19 KiB) Viewed 1753 times

Photo 4.

gcs_23_c.jpg (197.29 KiB) Viewed 1753 times

The Photo #4 (above) has been looked at before but with a different focus. It is a raw coin I have attributed as a VAM-1CK. http://www.vamworld.com/forum/viewtopic ... 923#p32691



I was looking closely at the relationship of the 'Triangle' to the die crack that always seems to appear on the neck line. I found two varieties that the polished triangle 19 was the main feature pickup point;
VAM ICK and VAM 1BY are listed. That doesn't mean there is not more!*

*update_1923-P VAM 2A http://ec2-13-58-222-16.us-east-2.compu ... 3-P_VAM-2A has a 'polished area 19' not mentioned. Will add.



Thanks for sharing when you find something.

Great Fun.

*this post has been edited many, .. times for clarity.

[UNCLE BINGO]

Hi G , Man I don't have a picture of one , I don't think I own one at the present , and the one I did have like 10 months ago might be being used in a dentist office in a third world country by now but it came with a "Cleaned Guarantee"

As the lure of the Darkside keeps pulling this gentle tug on me at the present , I will keep an eye out if I see one of those because that slot is empty for now anyway ...

[jrfaust]

@Geseas It sure looks like the 1CK to me. The crack thru neck matches up. Can we get a full shot of the obverse? Nice photos by the way Does your coin have the crack thru the hair bun extending in too the lower field?
Hope this helps

[colwillys]

I have 3 VAM 1CK and the Discovery coin . The crack above 1 is high on the VAM 1CK , the crack on the VAM 1BY comes
down to the 1 . Their is a lot of FUN to be had playing with Peace Dollars . My VAM 1CK are MS 63

[keilg1]

The triangular polished area(s) seem to be correlative - meaning you see enough coins you will see similar 'things' but they might not be related. Because they're found on multiple different varieties suggests there might have been some part of the process (or multiple parts) that created a rub or oblique hit of the area repeatedly and with different obverse dies; similarly, those coins could have simply been hit obliquely by something in the bagging and/or transport process as similar types of 'polished' areas have been seen in multiple other areas of coins (and/or varieties).

My completely unofficial take would be they'd not be listable if this is of interest (which it seems to be)...

Apologies if it's not of interest and I misread the post!

[Geseas]

Thanks for the responses. They are all of interest and greatly appreciated.

gcs_23p_photo2 rduced.JPG (224.1 KiB) Viewed 1685 times

gcs_ Photo2_ bun2000.JPG (221.66 KiB) Viewed 1673 times

Photo #2 lfcp & Bun

@jrfaust Photos above are of the coin I labeled photo #2.

The coin I labeled Photo #1 probably is one of @colwillys. I copied it from the catalog online. The Vam 1CK.

close inspection of the crack leaving Bun and into the lower field.

1923 compare-01.jpeg (92.55 KiB) Viewed 1640 times

Just a small difference, but a difference imo.

One more comparison at the '19'; where I started:

gcs_copare19 -03.jpeg (108.72 KiB) Viewed 1562 times

photo #2 & VAM-1CK

Not a matching die crack. IMO

[Geseas]

The triangular polished area(s) seem to be correlative - meaning you see enough coins you will see similar 'things' but they might not be related. Because they're found on multiple different varieties suggests there might have been some part of the process (or multiple parts) that created a rub or oblique hit of the area repeatedly and with different obverse dies; similarly, those coins could have simply been hit obliquely by something in the bagging and/or transport process as similar types of 'polished' areas have been seen in multiple other areas of coins (and/or varieties).

My completely unofficial take would be they'd not be listable if this is of interest (which it seems to be)...

Apologies if it's not of interest and I misread the post!

@keilg1

The only justifying thing about those polished triangle marks is that they are on the die and are transferred to the coin.

I agree with you that they are unreliable markers;

I think its because the 'polished marks 19' were not designed to be on a coin; anywhere. They are a result of poor adjustment of the press, worn parts or a combination of things that can happen when pushing any tool or person too hard.

I have to believe the team that we have in place here (including ourselves) could distinguish between a polished die mark caused by a press malfunction versus that of a random PMD polishing event. I can only speak for myself here; but I would need to be poked with a stick first.
I think the two reflect the light differently. They are produced in a completely different way. It may be due to that difference
showing up in the 'crystalline structure'.

"Visible with a powerful scope but noticed by the naked eye."

My completely unofficial take, also.

[keilg1]

#lovethemystery!

[Geseas]

Hi G , Man I don't have a picture of one , I don't think I own one at the present , and the one I did have like 10 months ago might be being used in a dentist office in a third world country by now but it came with a "Cleaned Guarantee"

As the lure of the Darkside keeps pulling this gentle tug on me at the present , I will keep an eye out if I see one of those because that slot is empty for now anyway ...

@UNCLE BINGO you and friends are part of that adhesive that holds a site together! Thank you.

[UNCLE BINGO]

Aww Heck G, thanks ! Right back at ya . These Forums take a village to function, I guess just have to have a little fun doing what you love to do .

Sweet pictures BTW

[Geseas]

@UNCLE BINGO I will keep an eye out if I see one of those because that slot is empty for now anyway ...

I have been thinking about that Slot opening you have available...

Please consider this speculative observation.

The first two photographs of our 1923-P VAM-1CK page, found under Additional Photos: discover coin: I believe they are not of a VAM-1CK but rather a 1BY... I am guessing not even a 1BY: but rather its evil twin. Look closely at the crack cutting across on the Neck Line and how it interacts with its polished triangle and the '1' in Date 1923. Compare to the 1BY page...

Here is a photo of what I am trying to say. I have a hard time expressing myself with words Photograph attempt:

Comparing above-02.jpeg (60.59 KiB) Viewed 1335 times

Maybe get one of those for the slot...just a thought.

Those big polished triangles are an easy cherry-pick; even in lousy Ebay photos. Good luck!

[UNCLE BINGO]

Thanks G ,
I had a pretty lengthy conversation about the peace series with my buddy in his coin store yesterday ,
Of course he is all for the idea , I just am not really sure how to approach that particular subject right now .
We shall see what happens , I mean I like the coins and you could assemble most of the dates in somewhat good grades for somewhat reasonable sums of money . I just know how I am , I like stuff that is either unique or has a MS # that might be off the charts
I need to learn a lot more about these coins before jumping in with both feet ,
They are harder than the Franklin halves but easier than the Morgans ,IMO
And I do tend to get rather VAM- Stracked