1921P potential duplicate listings

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weth
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by weth » Thu May 25, 2023 6:11 pm

Thanks for that feedback, Roger! Because VAM 1BB was a late die state listing, there was always the possibility of a subsequent earlier die state listing, which would have split it into VAM 1BB1 and your 1BB2. But because the earlier die state shows doubling not seen in the initial listing, I believe you can now consider yourself as the discoverer of VAM 120A.

Some new listing changes being made by JB:

VAM 1Z has been retired, superseded by VAM 130
VAM 1BB is now recognized as VAM 120A
VAM 3GC has been retired as it is redundant with VAM 3FA1
VAM 3GP has been retired as being redundant with VAM 3AZ (not sure yet how I feel about this)
VAM 3HX has been retired as it is redundant with VAM 3GE

Some new issues I'm pursuing:

VAM 95 appears to be the same as VAM 1AW
VAM 98 appears to be the same as VAM 88/88A
VAM 122 appears to be the same as VAM 99
VAM 124 and VAM 112A may share the same reverse die
VAM 129 appears to be the same as VAM 1L

Tom

DHalladay
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by DHalladay » Thu May 25, 2023 7:08 pm

I believe you can now consider yourself as the discoverer of VAM 120A.
I agree!
Sorry @fogie, but Roger got the 120A first.
When in doubt... don't.

RogerRock
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Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 3:40 am

Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by RogerRock » Thu May 25, 2023 8:58 pm

weth wrote:
Thu May 25, 2023 6:11 pm
Thanks for that feedback, Roger! Because VAM 1BB was a late die state listing, there was always the possibility of a subsequent earlier die state listing, which would have split it into VAM 1BB1 and your 1BB2. But because the earlier die state shows doubling not seen in the initial listing, I believe you can now consider yourself as the discoverer of VAM 120A.

Some new listing changes being made by JB:

VAM 1Z has been retired, superseded by VAM 130
VAM 1BB is now recognized as VAM 120A
VAM 3GC has been retired as it is redundant with VAM 3FA1
VAM 3GP has been retired as being redundant with VAM 3AZ (not sure yet how I feel about this)
VAM 3HX has been retired as it is redundant with VAM 3GE

Some new issues I'm pursuing:

VAM 95 appears to be the same as VAM 1AW
VAM 98 appears to be the same as VAM 88/88A
VAM 122 appears to be the same as VAM 99
VAM 124 and VAM 112A may share the same reverse die
VAM 129 appears to be the same as VAM 1L

Tom
Will confirmation on 1921 P VAM 1BB changed over to VAM 120 A as my Discovery Piece retain original plate and description from LVA?
Stage 3 TERMINAL DIE STATE SILVER DOLLAR EXPLORER

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messydesk
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by messydesk » Fri May 26, 2023 12:39 am

I will update the VAM 120A page to say "Discovered by RogerRock as VAM 1BB in 20xx". I'll also add the relevant pictures from Leroy to that page. This will reflect what should have happened when Fogie submitted his coin, which is a revision and a renumbering of VAM 1BB as VAM 120A. I can't really fault him much. It's easy to miss things on 1921s.
Welcome to the VAMWorld 2.0 discussion boards. R.I.P. old VAMWorld.

weth
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by weth » Fri Jul 07, 2023 8:19 pm

JB agreed to two more reductions in the 21P set:

VAM 1L is retired, as it is redundant with VAM 129
VAM 98 is retired, as it is redundant with VAM 88

Also, Dennis and I are in agreement that VAM 124 and VAM 112 share a reverse die (124 first, then 112/112A)

DHalladay
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by DHalladay » Sat Jul 08, 2023 1:24 am

This is great news Tom! Thanks for spearheading this ongoing can of worms. :D
When in doubt... don't.

weth
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by weth » Fri Sep 15, 2023 4:03 pm

VAM 3Gi is retired, as it is redundant with VAM 3EF
Also, VAM 81/81A have been retired and divided into four stages, VAMs 3BQ1/2/3/4

DHalladay
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by DHalladay » Fri Sep 15, 2023 6:14 pm

weth wrote:
Fri Sep 15, 2023 4:03 pm
VAM 3Gi is retired, as it is redundant with VAM 3EF
Also, VAM 81/81A have been retired and divided into four stages, VAMs 3BQ1/2/3/4
Wow... and excellent!
Have the 3BQ1-2-3-4 stages pages been created?
When in doubt... don't.

weth
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by weth » Fri Sep 15, 2023 6:50 pm

DHalladay wrote:
Fri Sep 15, 2023 6:14 pm
Have the 3BQ1-2-3-4 stages pages been created?

It does look like JB created the 3BQ3 and 3BQ4 pages, but pictures need to be reassigned from the 3BQ1/3BQ2 pages.

I was trying to point out that there were at least three distinct die stages, but it got broken into four;
3BQ1: Before reverse polishing, only die file lines
3BQ2: Reverse polishing
3BQ3: Formation of break line through D
3BQ4: Displacement break at ED

DHalladay
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by DHalladay » Fri Sep 15, 2023 9:03 pm

Trying hard to figure out what I have now between 4 coins, but 3BQ4 seems to be the only one I'm confident about ruling out.

I have 2 coins with reverse file lines like crazy (which I had called VAM 81). Both have a diagonal line through the opening in D (along with cracks in the wreath and left ribbon):
DSC_8731.jpg
DSC_8731.jpg (323 KiB) Viewed 363 times


I also have 2 coins that do not have reverse file lines (which I had called VAM 3BQ). They do not have a diagonal line through the opening in D, but they do have a diagonal line that clips the right side of the D. Both coins also have cracks in the wreath and left ribbon like the other 2 coins:
DSC_8733.jpg
DSC_8733.jpg (321.44 KiB) Viewed 363 times
When in doubt... don't.

weth
Posts: 350
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by weth » Sat Sep 16, 2023 1:52 am

Hey Dennis,
Your first photo pretty clearly matches VAM 3BQ3.
Your second photo shows an earlier die state than what I sent JB, so I would call that VAM 3BQ1 EDS.

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messydesk
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by messydesk » Sat Sep 16, 2023 1:59 am

Yeah, I need to work on those pages. There are some 21-S pages I need to rework as well. I tried to write the specification so that the pictures wouldn't really be necessary to tell the stages apart. Line through the D with no radial crack is 3BQ3, with radial crack 3BQ4.
Welcome to the VAMWorld 2.0 discussion boards. R.I.P. old VAMWorld.

DHalladay
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by DHalladay » Sat Sep 16, 2023 2:38 pm

Thanks Tom and John. Looks like I still need 2 of the 4... 3BQ2 and 3BQ4.
When in doubt... don't.

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fogie
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by fogie » Tue Sep 19, 2023 3:57 am

I think the registry is all caught up.
Have a great day!

weth
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Re: 1921P potential duplicate listings

Post by weth » Thu Oct 05, 2023 7:17 pm

VAM 77 has been retired, as it is the same as VAM 69 EDS

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