1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

General discussion board about VAMs, but no buy/sell offers
Geseas
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Location: West Michigan

1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by Geseas » Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:38 pm

Hello everyone. Any ideas for this VAM?

The shoulder spikes seem to have been almost polished away. This leads me to a VAM-41A.

Does the VAM-41A or VAM-3A have a hint of a collar clash on Rev.?
Thank you for your comments and insight.
GCS3794.JPG
GCS3794.JPG (270.44 KiB) Viewed 1030 times
GCS3757~2.JPG
GCS3757~2.JPG (276.12 KiB) Viewed 1030 times
gcs 22_P Vam-3A.jpg
gcs 22_P Vam-3A.jpg (317.37 KiB) Viewed 1015 times
Thank you @colwillys
Last edited by Geseas on Fri Jan 22, 2021 6:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.

colwillys
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by colwillys » Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:55 pm

low grade VAM 3A with collar clash . No to VAM 41A .

Geseas
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Location: West Michigan

Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by Geseas » Sat Jan 23, 2021 12:30 am

Would anyone have a picture of a 1922-P VAM-3A reverse?
1922-P VAM-3A.jpg
1922-P VAM-3A.jpg (149.82 KiB) Viewed 1002 times
http://ec2-13-58-222-16.us-east-2.compu ... everse.jpg This is the only photo I can locate.
Thanks for help.

RogerB
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by RogerB » Sat Jan 23, 2021 3:49 am

What is the white caret pointing to?

Geseas
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Location: West Michigan

Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by Geseas » Sat Jan 23, 2021 5:05 am

RogerB wrote:
Sat Jan 23, 2021 3:49 am
What is the white caret pointing to?
White caret is pointing at the location of shoulder clash spikes. I have not found where the little arrows are on this machine yet.

RogerB
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by RogerB » Sat Jan 23, 2021 5:46 pm

OK. I thought they might point to a "collar clash" which is impossible at that location on the coin.

Geseas
Posts: 227
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2019 2:49 am
Location: West Michigan

Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by Geseas » Sat Jan 23, 2021 6:42 pm

RogerB wrote:
Sat Jan 23, 2021 5:46 pm
OK. I thought they might point to a "collar clash" which is impossible at that location on the coin.
Thanks @RogerB I have experimented with different ways/methods of indicating a detail within a photograph; because I can't seem to find the 'good little arrows' on a Chrome OS.
I think a series of 'little dots' is the best. In my opinion. Here's a sample of what I mean from an old post:
dots below detail.jpg
dots below detail.jpg (203.73 KiB) Viewed 956 times
This is easy to do on this machine I have. I find Leroy's arrows to be vague, kind of like that white caret above. This is especially true when Vamworld is your only point of reference.

RogerB
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by RogerB » Sat Jan 23, 2021 8:51 pm

Here are some things I do as work-arounds.

Prepare the image normally, then open MSword. Next, insert a table with one cell for each photo you want to publish or add details to. Save the file. Open the file and use MSWord to add arrows, call-outs and other graphics over the image. When you have what you want, save the file.

To turn the Word page into an image you can either, open the file, right click on the image and select "Save As" Picture. You can also do "Copy" and then Paste it into the Google imaging program, and work from there. Another way is to save the Word page as an Adobe PDF using 2400 dpi resolution, then save the PDF as JPG with highest quality and 300 or 600 dpi resolution.

All of these options should preserve the arrows, etc. Here's a sample from a book on Eagles I'm writing.
RICA 1138-2529r detail.jpg
RICA 1138-2529r detail.jpg (452.18 KiB) Viewed 945 times

RogerB
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by RogerB » Sat Jan 23, 2021 9:02 pm

PS: Google "Chrome" might have a "pen" tool; this is where you might find arrows in a sub menu.

Geseas
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Location: West Michigan

Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by Geseas » Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:07 am

RogerB wrote:
Sat Jan 23, 2021 9:02 pm
PS: Google "Chrome" might have a "pen" tool; this is where you might find arrows in a sub menu.
This is what I did. You will be seeing some creative arrows from me after a little practice. Thanks, RWB.

RogerB
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by RogerB » Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:15 am

Glad to be of help!

Geseas
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Location: West Michigan

Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by Geseas » Sun Jan 24, 2021 10:06 pm

Please check out these lines. I made the nicest arrows for the photo but it would not let me export them. The Google program would not let go; until they made some money somehow.

Have to work with these arrows for now...(they are by Google also. Payed for when computer was purchased.)
1922 shoulder.jpg
1922 shoulder.jpg (146.95 KiB) Viewed 916 times
Here are the lines on the Vamworld photo of the 1922-P VAM-41A:
VamWorld 22p V41A.jpg
VamWorld 22p V41A.jpg (122.52 KiB) Viewed 916 times
The file lines seem very close to a match: that may only count in the game of horseshoes.

I am embarrassed to show you the Obv.; Low grade as @colwillys mentioned. The obverse was painted with something and I have been experimenting on it with acetone and what I have learned here on this site to remove.
22p we are better.jpeg
22p we are better.jpeg (144.6 KiB) Viewed 899 times

This next photo is after an agitated on/off, many day soak.
GCS3787.JPG
GCS3787.JPG (217.91 KiB) Viewed 899 times
Looks like a long deal but you can see some progress...


How would you go about seeing a full Rev. photo of these two Vams? I have no hard book reference material yet; just the internet.



Thanks for any suggestions.
Last edited by Geseas on Thu Jan 28, 2021 4:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

RogerB
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by RogerB » Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:56 pm

RE: " I made the nicest arrows for the photo but it would not let me export them. The Google program would not let go; until they made some money somehow."

Can you merge the arrows into your photo, save, and then export the saved photo to your computer?

(PS: The whole concept of continually paying for access to a software program is, to me, repugnant.)

Geseas
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Location: West Michigan

Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by Geseas » Mon Jan 25, 2021 7:05 pm

Thank you RWB for your continued support of this topic.


photo test:
1922-P left shoulder Rev.jpg
1922-P left shoulder Rev.jpg (89.71 KiB) Viewed 878 times
Persistence pays off. The key was in the 'save as' button.
I will be checking out those arrows in your new book when it's published.

RogerB
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by RogerB » Mon Jan 25, 2021 8:08 pm

The software should also allow you to select the shank width (in pixels) and the head type/shape/length. That will let you define arrows (like the one in my illustration) to your liking, then scale them to photos of differing resolutions.

PS: Interesting reverse clashes, too!

crabscrape
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by crabscrape » Mon Jan 25, 2021 9:54 pm

What does the caret have to do with the question asked here on this thread? like I always said has nothing to do with what question was asked!!!!!!!

crabscrape
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by crabscrape » Mon Jan 25, 2021 9:57 pm

I can tell Everyone about the collar clashes that have been posted over the years. Please stop the drama!

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pup_picker
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by pup_picker » Mon Jan 25, 2021 11:30 pm

paint.net is pretty useful and free.

you can also use PtrScr on the keyboard to get snapshots of what you are working on completely circumnavigating ANY software program but you aren't saving as nice of an image.

also windows "snip" is one of my all-time favorites. does the same thing as above except you pick the specific area to "snapshot" instead of the whole screen like PrtScr does.

i'm sure the basic program paint or win10 superpaint can do most of what you need. been using it for years for impressive stuff considering the simplicity of the program.

if you have any axe body spray, that stuff can remove some pretty stubborn surface contaminants but spray it into a cloth or paper towel lest your whole house smell like that crap. then wipe/dip in acetone or alcohol to remove the fragrance and then rinse in hot water to complete the project. be careful with any valuable/high-grade coins and make sure you have ventillation when using anything on coins. breathing that stuff in and out for years cannot be good.

i've never used paint thinner on coins but i'm sure a diluted version of it would work on that coin and it looks like a good test coin.

colwillys
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Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by colwillys » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:25 pm

With a test coin try Ammonia janitorial strength . (ACE hardware )... Ventilation is a must .
15to20 seconds and wash with hot water pat dry . DO NOT uses MS or valuable coin .

Geseas
Posts: 227
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2019 2:49 am
Location: West Michigan

Re: 1922-P collar and shoulder clashes:

Post by Geseas » Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:15 pm

Thanks for the helpful comments and suggestions.
This coin pictured here has Shoulder Spikes and a Collar Clash on the reverse. . These are both, arguably, stand-alone VAM attributions, according to Leroy.
I can not find another photo of any 1922-P on Vamworld or anywhere else that has a reverse like this. In my opinion, the following photo is of a rare coin; low grade as it is. Please prove me wrong with a photo or a link would be great. A snapshot of a coin with collar clash and shoulder spikes would do it for me. :D Thanks for a great site here.
Screenshot 2021-01-26 at 11.48.39 AM.jpg
Screenshot 2021-01-26 at 11.48.39 AM.jpg (49.28 KiB) Viewed 848 times
If you don't I am going to figure out how to send this ugly coin to Leroy. :popcorn:

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