1886 V-1P DC thread

General discussion board about VAMs, but no buy/sell offers
Post Reply
keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

1886 V-1P DC thread

Post by keilg1 » Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:38 pm

Hi all,

Been a while since I've posted. Now living in the UK but with my heart still in the US and my eye on one of my first loves.

I found an interesting PCGS 62 slabbed 1886P with what appears to be a 1E 'curved spiked 6' date - but I don't think it is. Date is definitely normal range (not near or far).

Interestingly I originally thought it'd be a VAM-17 because of a doubling of the reverse arrows (arrowheads and shafts) - but even these don't quite match up directly with the pictures of that one. No dot between leg and wing feathers on the left side, either.

Also thought it might be a 1M but didn't quite match up with that, too.

Thus, lobbing this to you experts.

Uploading photos in multiple batches to show:
* Obverse 6 - not a curved spike at all but clearly parallel lines that might be a 6/6 - definitely not a VAM1 'line in 6' or a 1M 'bar'
* Other obverse PUPs not described anywhere I can find are three lines in the bonnett fold
* and lines in E and Y of LIBERTY;
* Reverse including numerous pics of the arrow heads
* arrow shafts
* no apparent doubling of the feathers
* no 'S' die impression on outer wing feather like on VAM-1E1
* scratch lines in the lower feathers like the 1M but different (I think)
* other PUPs not mentioned elsewhere

Thus, I'm stuck.

Suggestions for me to look more closely at?

Thanks from jolly ol' England.

Gary
Attachments
1886P Vam-1E 6 closeup GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E 6 closeup GR.jpg (133.41 KiB) Viewed 1984 times
1886P Vam-1E Upper arrowhead GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E Upper arrowhead GR.jpg (96.21 KiB) Viewed 1984 times
1886P Vam-1E Bottom arrowhead GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E Bottom arrowhead GR.jpg (100.37 KiB) Viewed 1984 times
1886P Vam-1E Arrow shafts GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E Arrow shafts GR.jpg (101.02 KiB) Viewed 1984 times
Last edited by keilg1 on Mon Oct 04, 2021 6:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by keilg1 » Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:40 pm

Additional pictures #1 - obverse PUPs
Attachments
1886P Vam-1E PUPs Obv bonnett scratches GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E PUPs Obv bonnett scratches GR.jpg (152.41 KiB) Viewed 1983 times
1886P Vam-1E line E GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E line E GR.jpg (101.69 KiB) Viewed 1983 times
1886P Vam-1E line Y GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E line Y GR.jpg (1.2 MiB) Viewed 1983 times

keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by keilg1 » Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:41 pm

Additional pictures #2 - reverse PUPs
Attachments
1886P Vam-1E No S left rev wing GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E No S left rev wing GR.jpg (121.72 KiB) Viewed 1983 times
1886P Vam-1E PUPs right leaves #1 GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E PUPs right leaves #1 GR.jpg (101.25 KiB) Viewed 1983 times
1886P Vam-1E PUPs right leaves #2 GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E PUPs right leaves #2 GR.jpg (103.44 KiB) Viewed 1983 times
1886P Vam-1E PUPs right leaves #3 GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E PUPs right leaves #3 GR.jpg (114.27 KiB) Viewed 1983 times
1886P Vam-1E PUPs right leaves #4 GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E PUPs right leaves #4 GR.jpg (112.93 KiB) Viewed 1983 times

keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by keilg1 » Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:42 pm

Additional pictures #3 - reverse PUPs
Attachments
1886P Vam-1E POPs ribbon bow GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E POPs ribbon bow GR.jpg (85 KiB) Viewed 1982 times
1886P Vam-1E PUP field line olive branch tip GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E PUP field line olive branch tip GR.jpg (105.56 KiB) Viewed 1982 times
1886P Vam-1E PUPs lines in bottom feathers GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E PUPs lines in bottom feathers GR.jpg (117.86 KiB) Viewed 1983 times

keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by keilg1 » Sun Oct 18, 2020 8:21 am

I know the 86 series is not particularly interesting to many, but can any of the more experienced eyes please look and comment on this before it gets relegated into the dark bottoms of the discussion forum?

I happen to love what is going in in the 6 and and the doubled arrows although they're subtle.

Doubled arrows look a lot like Brent F's 1885-O VAMs 23 & 24 and Logan's VAM-24, too.

Thanks again,

Gary

User avatar
ljs123
Posts: 1550
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:16 pm

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by ljs123 » Sun Oct 18, 2020 8:44 pm

Can you post a full date location close up?
Also obverse and reverse LFCPs would be nice.
Thank you

keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by keilg1 » Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:02 pm

Thanks, LJS123.

Here are the additional pictures. Sorry, full date not quite in focus but the LFCP should show it well enough.

Looked at the doubled arrows of many multiple later years and the one I'm seeing is similar to the 86-O V-18, 87-S V-17, 88-O V-9 & 26, 89-P V-15 & 26, and quite a few more. Didn't realize this was as common as it might have been.

Gary
Attachments
1886P Vam-1E full date.jpg
1886P Vam-1E full date.jpg (123.24 KiB) Viewed 1916 times
1886P Vam-1E full obv GR.jpg
1886P Vam-1E full obv GR.jpg (277.95 KiB) Viewed 1916 times
1886P Vam-1E full rev GR.JPG
1886P Vam-1E full rev GR.JPG (272.4 KiB) Viewed 1916 times

keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by keilg1 » Tue Oct 27, 2020 4:30 pm

Please, experts, any help?

Vam-mysterio
Posts: 586
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:52 pm

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by Vam-mysterio » Tue Oct 27, 2020 6:05 pm

Hi
It appears you have a high date normal date placement,with attributes similar to a vam 1A or vam 1E due to the stuff inside the lower loop of 6,
But it doesn’t seem to match any of my coins in my set,also the doubling on rev seems very similar to the vam 17 but is not a v 17,
I suspect you have an unlisted die,
If I was you I would send it to Vss first,before sending to Leroy
Hope that was of any help

keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by keilg1 » Wed Oct 28, 2020 11:25 am

Really appreciate your input as I've not been able to see clearly what the inside of the VAM-IE "6" looks like - but I'm sure it doesn't match up. My untrained eye thinks it isn't a VAM-1A, too. Nothing else matching up on the reverse.

Will shoot it off to VSS when I can but I live in the UK now so it isn't easy. Wished this could be done electronically but absolutely need to have the coin in hand to do.

Again, appreciate your thoughts.

Gary

keilg1
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:36 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK

NEW DC: 1886 VAM-1P

Post by keilg1 » Sat Oct 02, 2021 2:04 pm

Attaching the updated information on this thread to show how wonderful the trip can be. And to keep a few more upclose pictures and PUPs that might aid others in the hunt for it...

In short, I thought this was not quite the same as described, input from helpful folks on the forum (@Vam-mysterio), vetted by sending it to @messydesk who agreed it had enough to send to Leroy, and Leroy's response:

Overall description to be added to the new page:
1886P V1P LVA description.JPG
1886P V1P LVA description.JPG (47.05 KiB) Viewed 495 times

Next, a few pictures from LVA to add as official:
1886P V1P LVA #1.JPG
1886P V1P LVA #1.JPG (196.6 KiB) Viewed 495 times
1886P V1P LVA #2.JPG
1886P V1P LVA #2.JPG (212 KiB) Viewed 495 times
1886P V1P LVA #3.JPG
1886P V1P LVA #3.JPG (194.33 KiB) Viewed 495 times
1886P V1P LVA #4.JPG
1886P V1P LVA #4.JPG (222.82 KiB) Viewed 495 times

Have two more DCs from the same batch sent to him that I will post soon.

@PacificWR, could you weave your magic to create a new page and upload whichever pictures you think relevant?

Discovery is a shared one between me (Gary Redfeather) and my dad (Gary Keil) - he got me into Morgans in the early 1970s and we're sharing the passion still...

Thanks, all, for your support.

Gary
Gary Redfeather, PhD, RPh

https://www.linkedin.com/in/drgarykeil/

Click https://gjkeil2-82005.medium.com/our-lo ... 485d6cf0a5 to read the backstory of my surname change

User avatar
PacificWR
Posts: 1707
Joined: Mon May 28, 2018 12:17 pm
Location: Kansas Flint Hills
Contact:

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by PacificWR » Sat Oct 02, 2021 5:15 pm

Good work. I'll setup the new page.

blh74
Posts: 658
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:28 am

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by blh74 » Sun Oct 03, 2021 12:18 am

Nice.

User avatar
PacificWR
Posts: 1707
Joined: Mon May 28, 2018 12:17 pm
Location: Kansas Flint Hills
Contact:

Re: 1886P VAM-1E with double arrow reverse

Post by PacificWR » Mon Oct 04, 2021 2:39 am

The new VAM-1P page is all setup.

Post Reply