O/T Daniel Carr 2020

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colwillys
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by colwillys » Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:36 am

How can it be a counterfeit , if the mint did not mint the coin of those years .
I still love all the comments .. Token not legal tender . :idea: :oops:

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ljs123
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by ljs123 » Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:13 pm

colwillys wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:36 am
How can it be a counterfeit , if the mint did not mint the coin of those years .
I still love all the comments .. Token not legal tender . :idea: :oops:

“Token not legal tender” seems similar to counterfeit is illegal tender to me.

I wonder if intent makes the difference between token and counterfeit?
These tokens were never intended to be used for money or thought that others would be fooled into thinking that they were legal tender.

Tom,
Whatever the difference, you have a nice piece of silver there. Congratulations
Last edited by ljs123 on Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

colwillys
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by colwillys » Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:00 pm

Thank You LEE .. I look at it and see Art work not just silver . Eye of the beholder .
Love to all the VamWorld family .

RogerB
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by RogerB » Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:07 pm

Anything that has a country of issuance and a denomination is a counterfeit. Nothing else matters. In addition, if it can be used like a coin or was used as money - think of slugs for vending machines and ancient coins - it also comes under the very simple and easy to understand counterfeiting laws.

There is a legal exception - It is called the Hobby Protection Act. This permits any counterfeit to be stamped with the word "COPY" and it then is a legal "replica" and not a counterfeit. If the counterfeits coming from China, Colorado, or Vietnam were properly stamped, there would be no difficulties.

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ljs123
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by ljs123 » Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:18 pm

colwillys wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:00 pm
Thank You LEE .. I look at it and see Art work not just silver . Eye of the beholder .
Love to all the VamWorld family .
I agree with you Tom. It is art work. My use of the term "piece of silver" may have been a poor choice of words.
Again, Congratulations :)

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alefzero
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by alefzero » Sat Aug 22, 2020 6:37 pm

Not a counterfeit as the Mint claims that there are no 1964-D dollars. The prototypes were claimed to have been all received back and destroyed along with the dies. Carr's production blog further points out distinct die markers for his overstrike tokens. Not saying they are not without controversy, but the government has not had a problem with his products. He appears to have covered his bases. No COPY stamp is needed for a product without an original.

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vampicker
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by vampicker » Sat Aug 22, 2020 9:10 pm

I'd daresay the grading policies of a private firm are determined by that firm.

The argument against this thing would have seemed a great deal stronger and yet...
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alefzero
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by alefzero » Tue Aug 25, 2020 6:05 pm

His offerings went down to just the Covid medal a couple weeks back. Is he shut down for a while?

RogerB
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by RogerB » Wed Aug 26, 2020 2:49 am

alefzero wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 6:37 pm
Not a counterfeit as the Mint claims that there are no 1964-D dollars. The prototypes were claimed to have been all received back and destroyed along with the dies. Carr's production blog further points out distinct die markers for his overstrike tokens. Not saying they are not without controversy, but the government has not had a problem with his products. He appears to have covered his bases. No COPY stamp is needed for a product without an original.
That is a lie.

Anything that looks or can be used like a coin, and lacks the HPA stamp is a COUNTERFEIT.

Prove your assertion with a letter from the US Mint or the Secret Service or even the Federal Trade Commission.

crabscrape
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by crabscrape » Wed Aug 26, 2020 12:02 pm

This is interesting!!

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alefzero
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by alefzero » Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:24 am

RogerB wrote:
Wed Aug 26, 2020 2:49 am
alefzero wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 6:37 pm
Not a counterfeit as the Mint claims that there are no 1964-D dollars. The prototypes were claimed to have been all received back and destroyed along with the dies. Carr's production blog further points out distinct die markers for his overstrike tokens. Not saying they are not without controversy, but the government has not had a problem with his products. He appears to have covered his bases. No COPY stamp is needed for a product without an original.
That is a lie.

Anything that looks or can be used like a coin, and lacks the HPA stamp is a COUNTERFEIT.

Prove your assertion with a letter from the US Mint or the Secret Service or even the Federal Trade Commission.
I will see if I can casually find it later (not something I just have digitally filed away as there is no such need), but Carr actually presented such a letter from the Mint director in defense of his product. It was in the major coin publications at the time too.

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alefzero
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by alefzero » Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:31 am

Roger - You and Dan went through this already and can continue between the two of you. I do not expect to be pulled into it.

http://www.moonlightmint.com/burdette_rebuttal_post.htm

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CascadeChris
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by CascadeChris » Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:14 pm

alefzero wrote:
Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:31 am
Roger - You and Dan went through this already and can continue between the two of you. I do not expect to be pulled into it.

http://www.moonlightmint.com/burdette_rebuttal_post.htm
Yeah, I posted this (screenshot below) but then deleted it because I didn't want to get sucked into this. But since you bring it up... Roger has a big burr up his craw for Dan and he tries to infect every numi board he moves on to when he's eventually banned from his board du juor (moving here from CU after being banned for a 2nd (maybe 3rd?) Time) this kind of hate directed at a member here is uncalled for an should not be allowed. But thats not my call of course...
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crabscrape
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by crabscrape » Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:09 am

a lot of folks have come over from CU, to post here.

vamsterdam
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by vamsterdam » Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:03 pm

wow, that was some hostile reading. i had no idea. sorry to see Dan was given such a hard time.

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CascadeChris
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by CascadeChris » Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:32 pm

vamsterdam wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:03 pm
wow, that was some hostile reading. i had no idea. sorry to see Dan was given such a hard time.
hope you're not a cat guy too 😬
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Longstrider
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by Longstrider » Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:58 pm

What is CU? Not trying to be a smart ass. Thanks. 🐍

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CascadeChris
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by CascadeChris » Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:26 pm

Longstrider wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:58 pm
What is CU? Not trying to be a smart ass. Thanks. 🐍
Collectors Universe... The PCGS forum
Alonzi VW 2.0!

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Longstrider
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Re: O/T Daniel Carr 2020

Post by Longstrider » Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:21 pm

@CascadeChris Thanks.🐍

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