1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

General discussion board about VAMs, but no buy/sell offers
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bhinkle
Posts: 426
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:34 am

1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by bhinkle » Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:28 pm

I found a couple of my 1921 Morgan's, after looking at Dennis's
post yesterday.
Here is my 1921 NGCMS63, that I don't remember what vam it is.
I saw the pitting, but I bought it, because of the two gouged areas,
one running, from the neck to the top of the wing and one on the
breast feathers.
I don't see the collar clash on the obverse, 4 to 5 o'clock.
I don't see the gouge by the one.
I see the tripled left stars.
Any help would be greatly appreciated, Thanks Bert
Attachments
1921 NGCMS63 OBV S.jpg
1921 NGCMS63 OBV S.jpg (230.35 KiB) Viewed 305 times
1921 NGCMS63 REV S.jpg
1921 NGCMS63 REV S.jpg (214.61 KiB) Viewed 305 times
Mon Mar 02 16-39-29 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-39-29 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (131.83 KiB) Viewed 305 times
Mon Mar 02 16-22-32 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-22-32 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (128.07 KiB) Viewed 305 times
Mon Mar 02 16-22-01 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-22-01 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (147.14 KiB) Viewed 305 times

bhinkle
Posts: 426
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:34 am

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by bhinkle » Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:33 pm

More pictures
Attachments
Mon Mar 02 16-38-25 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-38-25 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (149.56 KiB) Viewed 302 times
Mon Mar 02 16-24-53 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-24-53 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (140.52 KiB) Viewed 302 times
Mon Mar 02 16-40-58 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-40-58 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (159.64 KiB) Viewed 302 times
Mon Mar 02 16-25-40 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-25-40 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (156.35 KiB) Viewed 302 times
Mon Mar 02 16-23-13 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-23-13 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (148.8 KiB) Viewed 302 times

bhinkle
Posts: 426
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:34 am

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by bhinkle » Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:36 pm

More pictures
Attachments
Mon Mar 02 17-11-16 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 17-11-16 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (144.45 KiB) Viewed 302 times
Mon Mar 02 16-28-12 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-28-12 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (117.05 KiB) Viewed 302 times
Mon Mar 02 16-26-29 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-26-29 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (130.4 KiB) Viewed 302 times

collectinsince65
Posts: 625
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2019 12:55 am
Location: Florida

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by collectinsince65 » Mon Mar 02, 2020 11:08 pm

Gonna say 41B

DHalladay
Posts: 1475
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 4:38 pm

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by DHalladay » Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:07 am

Yep... 41B.
When in doubt... don't.

bhinkle
Posts: 426
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:34 am

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by bhinkle » Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:48 pm

Thank you Mike and Dennis.

bhinkle
Posts: 426
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:34 am

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by bhinkle » Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:07 am

I almost forgot to ask.
Below is a photo, from the vam 41 page and, showing a collar clash on the vam 41B and below that is a photo of my 1921, showing no collar clash.
Does that make a difference?
I was just trying to see, what die markers determine the difference, between the 41A and 41B vams.
Thanks, Bert
Attachments
1921 P VAM 41B Collar clash 4-5 O'clock.jpg
1921 P VAM 41B Collar clash 4-5 O'clock.jpg (99.1 KiB) Viewed 266 times
Mon Mar 02 16-28-12 1921 NGCMS63.jpg
Mon Mar 02 16-28-12 1921 NGCMS63.jpg (117.05 KiB) Viewed 266 times

DHalladay
Posts: 1475
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 4:38 pm

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by DHalladay » Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:54 am

I just checked my 41, 41A, and four 41Bs. All are in holders, which makes things a bit difficult to see, but there doesn't appear to be collar clashing on any of them.
When in doubt... don't.

RogerRock
Posts: 266
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 3:40 am

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by RogerRock » Wed Mar 04, 2020 1:22 am

Die file lines on lower reverse in addition to the pitted die is the main PUP for VAM 41B. Vam 41A has the
pitted die lower reverse without die file lines. The collar clash on VAM 41B is temporary and will wear away
as the die strikes more specimens!
The "gouges" you referred to on the eagle's breast and neck to wing are actually "strike thru debris"
striking errors. Genuine gouges are located on the die as incuse damage that transfers onto the struck
coin as a raised line or band.
Hope this explanation helps.
Stage 3 TERMINAL DIE STATE SILVER DOLLAR EXPLORER

blh74
Posts: 407
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:28 am

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by blh74 » Wed Mar 04, 2020 5:33 am

RogerRock wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 1:22 am
Die file lines on lower reverse in addition to the pitted die is the main PUP for VAM 41B. Vam 41A has the
pitted die lower reverse without die file lines. The collar clash on VAM 41B is temporary and will wear away
as the die strikes more specimens!
The "gouges" you referred to on the eagle's breast and neck to wing are actually "strike thru debris"
striking errors. Genuine gouges are located on the die as incuse damage that transfers onto the struck
coin as a raised line or band.
Hope this explanation helps.
About the collar clash. I sent to LVA a 1902 P with a slanted date and collar clash. He made it V29 and V29a. No mention of collar clash being temporary from LVA.

Kissov
Posts: 312
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:14 pm

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by Kissov » Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:27 pm

DHalladay wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:54 am
I just checked my 41, 41A, and four 41Bs. All are in holders, which makes things a bit difficult to see, but there doesn't appear to be collar clashing on any of them.
I checked my 41Bs (more than I need, less than I want!). Two in holders, the rest raw. None show a collar clash.

RogerRock
Posts: 266
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 3:40 am

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by RogerRock » Wed Mar 04, 2020 4:55 pm

Kissov wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:27 pm
DHalladay wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:54 am
I just checked my 41, 41A, and four 41Bs. All are in holders, which makes things a bit difficult to see, but there doesn't appear to be collar clashing on any of them.
I checked my 41Bs (more than I need, less than I want!). Two in holders, the rest raw. None show a collar clash.
Close inspection of my two 41Bs in ANACS MS 63 holders do not exhibit collar clash.
That comment "(more than I need, less than I want)" is rich !! Seems to be a common affliction .. :lol: :roll:
Stage 3 TERMINAL DIE STATE SILVER DOLLAR EXPLORER

dave700x
Posts: 389
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2018 12:36 am
Location: Texas

Re: 1921 VAM 41A OR VAM41B?

Post by dave700x » Wed Mar 04, 2020 5:01 pm

The one I have cataloged 41B does not have the collar clash either. The one I have cataloged 41A I'll need to double check my attribution. I scored it off ebay early last year maybe, so if Dennis let me win it there's a good chance it may actually be a 41B...
1883-O nut

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